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165 - Taylor

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This is a 100% serious question….

 

Is Taylor’s goal to not let anyone get more than an escape or tech/pin every opponent? I really think both are feasible at the same time… It is really clear there is no other competition to compete with him this year at HIS level.

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This is a 100% serious question….

 

Is Taylor’s goal to not let anyone get more than an escape or tech/pin every opponent? I really think both are feasible at the same time… It is really clear there is no other competition to compete with him this year at HIS level.

 

It's funny but over the years we've been treated to the historical reference of "There is always somebody out there better than you" time and time again.

 

Schlatter came in a force to be reckoned with, our next four time NCAA champion and suddenly there was Metcalf...

 

Metcalf was now our force to be reckoned with, would win the Hodge three years in a row, never to be challenged for the NCAA title and then there was Caldwell....

 

We as fans dream so vividly of the heroic seemingly superhuman individual that can go on the mat, never face defeat and dominate the competition without flaw.

 

If it wouldn't have been for Bubba Jenkins and Kyle Dake, Taylor would've been our other guy! (Sanderson being the other)

 

We settle though, for those who can do it in multiple seasons or even one season.

 

This year I think we get it.

 

Taylor and Ruth. I'd be shocked if anyone gives them a decent match and I'll most likely faint in disbelief if anyone beats them (outside of a medical forfeit).

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Johnny, Please bring your smelling salts to all matches where DT and ER compete. Although I agree they are two studly guys, so far Cael is alone. Even he lost a RS match I think. AND.. I am not bringing that up to denigrate Cael but to illustrate a point. Anyone can lose any day.

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Taylor beat Howe much worse in freestyle this past summer then Howe beat Taylor the year before. As for folkstyle, how does Howe win? He isn't better from neutral and Taylor is light years ahead on the mat. I think if Howe were to cut down to 165 (which he isn't), DT dominates him much like he did Caldwell.

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Taylor beat Howe much worse in freestyle this past summer then Howe beat Taylor the year before. As for folkstyle, how does Howe win? He isn't better from neutral and Taylor is light years ahead on the mat. I think if Howe were to cut down to 165 (which he isn't), DT dominates him much like he did Caldwell.

 

In my opinion, it's far from a given that Taylor is better than Howe in neutral. Why is that obvious to you? So many people said that before Taylor ran into Kyle Dake and was made to look very ordinary in neutral.I also disagree that Taylor is light years better on the mat. I wouldn't be too suprised if Howe were to outwrestle him on that mat.

 

"How does Howe win?". How did Howe win in freestyle?

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Taylor beat Howe much worse in freestyle this past summer then Howe beat Taylor the year before. As for folkstyle, how does Howe win? He isn't better from neutral and Taylor is light years ahead on the mat. I think if Howe were to cut down to 165 (which he isn't), DT dominates him much like he did Caldwell.

 

In my opinion, it's far from a given that Taylor is better than Howe in neutral. Why is that obvious to you? So many people said that before Taylor ran into Kyle Dake and was made to look very ordinary in neutral. I also disagree that Taylor is light years better on the mat. I wouldn't be too suprised if Howe were to outwrestle him on that mat.

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Taylor beat Howe much worse in freestyle this past summer then Howe beat Taylor the year before. As for folkstyle, how does Howe win? He isn't better from neutral and Taylor is light years ahead on the mat. I think if Howe were to cut down to 165 (which he isn't), DT dominates him much like he did Caldwell.

 

In my opinion, it's far from a given that Taylor is better than Howe in neutral. Why is that obvious to you? So many people said that before Taylor ran into Kyle Dake and was made to look very ordinary in neutral.I also disagree that Taylor is light years better on the mat. I wouldn't be too suprised if Howe were to outwrestle him on that mat.

 

"How does Howe win?". How did Howe win in freestyle?

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Taylor beat Howe much worse in freestyle this past summer then Howe beat Taylor the year before. As for folkstyle, how does Howe win? He isn't better from neutral and Taylor is light years ahead on the mat. I think if Howe were to cut down to 165 (which he isn't), DT dominates him much like he did Caldwell.

 

I disagree. Review both videos. Howe broke DT in the first match with methodical, overpowering TDs. In the second he went for a throw and DT caught him, trapped an arm and tilted him for a quick tech.

 

Might need to go find those videos and post.

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Comparisons to Dake (Top 3 all time), really, Howe is not Dake and isn't on the same planet when it comes to Mat wrestling. Shuck, disregarding more recent results, by a wider margin no less, is just as suspect. You can try to spin it all you want but Taylor is much better in freestyle then he was when he lost to Howe and he did tech fall him just a few months ago, no getting around that FACT as badly as you want to. Maybe you need to watch some RECENT video and stop acting as if things don't change. Didn't Dake lose to Howe and Paulson back then also? Didn't Dake beat Paulson and Howe this past summer? Heck Caldwell placed better then Taylor back then and people were saying he would beat him in folk and we saw how that turned out.

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Taylor's legacy needs a win over someone like howe.. What is his biggest win to date?

His legacy will actually be just fine regardless of who he beats this year. He'll likely end up as a 2x champ with his only losses coming to Bubba and Dake. Nobody will hold losing to Dake against him, but admittedly, he probably should have beaten Bubba, and that would have elevated his legacy to have been undefeated as a freshman and for his only losses on his record to come against a 4Xer in Dake. But to answer your question, his biggest win in NCAA wrestling has probably been against Caldwell. Given Caldwell's accomplishments, and the margin of victory (it wasn't even close), it's a legit win for sure. Other notable wins would include St. John and Fittery, although the St. John match was during their freshman seasons, before St. John had any results to speak of, so I still think the win over Caldwell is probably the most impressive NCAA victory.

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Comparisons to Dake (Top 3 all time), really, Howe is not Dake and isn't on the same planet when it comes to Mat wrestling. Shuck, disregarding more recent results, by a wider margin no less, is just as suspect. You can try to spin it all you want but Taylor is much better in freestyle then he was when he lost to Howe and he did tech fall him just a few months ago, no getting around that FACT as badly as you want to. Maybe you need to watch some RECENT video and stop acting as if things don't change. Didn't Dake lose to Howe and Paulson back then also? Didn't Dake beat Paulson and Howe this past summer? Heck Caldwell placed better then Taylor back then and people were saying he would beat him in folk and we saw how that turned out.

 

So do you have anything to back up your claim that Taylor is better than Howe in neutral, and light years ahead of Howe on the mat? Anything at all?

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Taylor's legacy needs a win over someone like howe.. What is his biggest win to date?

His legacy will actually be just fine regardless of who he beats this year. He'll likely end up as a 2x champ with his only losses coming to Bubba and Dake. Nobody will hold losing to Dake against him, but admittedly, he probably should have beaten Bubba, and that would have elevated his legacy to have been undefeated as a freshman and for his only losses on his record to come against a 4Xer in Dake. But to answer your question, his biggest win in NCAA wrestling has probably been against Caldwell. Given Caldwell's accomplishments, and the margin of victory (it wasn't even close), it's a legit win for sure. Other notable wins would include St. John and Fittery, although the St. John match was during their freshman seasons, before St. John had any results to speak of, so I still think the win over Caldwell is probably the most impressive NCAA victory.

 

I agree that Taylor's biggest collegiate win is over Caldwell. It was a great performance. One thing I disagree with is not holding his losses to Dake against him. I believe those losses are HUGE. I think some relevant facts on that issue get ignored. I'll try to lay this out in my hopefully near future multi part series on David Taylor's legacy.

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Hey FT, I think I was pretty neutral in my original post in this thread. If Taylor and Howe had wrestled three matches, do you think Tayloy techs him 3x?

 

Bringing up his loss where you say he was dominated yet failing to mention the fact he won by tf a couple months ago is not neutral. Just wanted to make sure all relevant facts were out there and my post was not combative. Of corse that led to to comparisons to Dake by one poster and the diminishment of Taylor's win by you. That's when I realized I haven't gotten into a forum scrap in a while and need to get in shape for the season. ;)

 

As far as 3 matches, I think DT would mix a fall in there :D

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I predict that DT will score bonus team points in every match this season. I'm looking forward to attending the All-Star Classic and particularly how Howe handles the matching physical strength and aggressiveness of Brown on a collegiate mat with Brown having gained experience and confidence and a nothing to lose attitude.

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I predict that DT will score bonus team points in every match this season. I'm looking forward to attending the All-Star Classic and particularly how Howe handles the matching physical strength and aggressiveness of Brown on a collegiate mat with Brown having gained experience and confidence and a nothing to lose attitude.

 

If Howe decides to drop down to 165 I see DT handling Howe much like he did Sponseller who always battled Howe close.

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I predict that DT will score bonus team points in every match this season. I'm looking forward to attending the All-Star Classic and particularly interested to see how Howe handles the matching physical strength and aggressiveness of Brown on a collegiate mat with Brown having gained experience and confidence and a nothing to lose attitude.

 

If Howe decides to drop down to 165 I see DT handling Howe much like he did Sponseller who always battled Howe close.

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I predict that DT will score bonus team points in every match this season. I'm looking forward to attending the All-Star Classic and particularly interested to see how Howe handles the matching physical strength and aggressiveness of Brown on a collegiate mat with Brown having gained experience and confidence and a nothing to lose attitude.

 

If Howe decides to drop down to 165 I see DT handling Howe much like he did Sponseller who always battled Howe close.

 

You see Taylor beating Howe by 10+ points? Just out of curiosity, what was your Dake/Taylor prediction before their first match?

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I predict that DT will score bonus team points in every match this season. I'm looking forward to attending the All-Star Classic and particularly interested to see how Howe handles the matching physical strength and aggressiveness of Brown on a collegiate mat with Brown having gained experience and confidence and a nothing to lose attitude.

 

If Howe decides to drop down to 165 I see DT handling Howe much like he did Sponseller who always battled Howe close.

 

You see Taylor beating Howe by 10+ points? Just out of curiosity, what was your Dake/Taylor prediction before their first match?

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