Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
MSU158

What should Jenkins have done after Sanderson arrived?

Recommended Posts

The Molinaro vs Bubba thread made me start to really think what I would have done in Bubba's shoes. SHP said that all here agree that there was plenty of wrong done on BOTH sides. I do NOT like what Bubba did, but I don't see what ELSE he could have done.

 

I would really like to hear HONEST answers from all here. What would you have done and, more importantly to me, why?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He should have gotten his redshirt and chance to wrestle off for 157. DT probably would have done just as well bumping straight up to 165. I don't even remember who was there for psu. Sometimes a coach can force things along a little too much. You lose fluidity that way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dan Vallimont was there.

that was the season david taylor and bubba would have both redshirted the next year would have had kemmerer and vollrath splitting time at 165 the team would have been better with bubba at 157 and taylor at 165

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dan Vallimont was there.

 

 

Huh? Are you in a different universe? In this one Vallimont was at 165 and would have graduated that year and Cyler Sanderson had transferred to PSU for his senior year at 157. David Taylor had also had his NLI released and was redshirting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Molinaro vs Bubba thread made me start to really think what I would have done in Bubba's shoes. SHP said that all here agree that there was plenty of wrong done on BOTH sides. I do NOT like what Bubba did, but I don't see what ELSE he could have done.

 

I would really like to hear HONEST answers from all here. What would you have done and, more importantly to me, why?

 

To me he had 2 legit options.

 

1. Wrestle 149 for his senior year like the coaches wanted him to and which would have been the best option for the team.

2. If he wasn't willing to do #1 then transfer immediately.

 

What he did instead was flunk classes on purposes to be academically ineligible the first semester and then miss weight at 157 for Mat Town and wrestle anyway at 165 so he wasn't eligible to wrestle 149 that season no matter what, guaranteeing he got the redshirt he wanted.

 

Here's a question back at you and I'd appreciate an honest answer. What would you have done with a wrestler who did the above things if you were coach?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Molinaro vs Bubba thread made me start to really think what I would have done in Bubba's shoes. SHP said that all here agree that there was plenty of wrong done on BOTH sides. I do NOT like what Bubba did, but I don't see what ELSE he could have done.

 

I would really like to hear HONEST answers from all here. What would you have done and, more importantly to me, why?

 

To me he had 2 legit options.

 

1. Wrestle 149 for his senior year like the coaches wanted him to and which would have been the best option for the team.

2. If he wasn't willing to do #1 then transfer immediately.

 

What he did instead was flunk classes on purposes to be academically ineligible the first semester and then miss weight at 157 for Mat Town and wrestle anyway at 165 so he wasn't eligible to wrestle 149 that season no matter what, guaranteeing he got the redshirt he wanted.

 

Here's a question back at you and I'd appreciate an honest answer. What would you have done with a wrestler who did the above things if you were coach?

 

penn state told him he would get a redshirt and five years on scholarship

 

does a school have any commitment to the athlete

 

should cael have issued a full release allowing him to attend any school he wanted

 

or are you saying there is nothing wrong with a coach coming in and breaking promises made by the program

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Molinaro vs Bubba thread made me start to really think what I would have done in Bubba's shoes. SHP said that all here agree that there was plenty of wrong done on BOTH sides. I do NOT like what Bubba did, but I don't see what ELSE he could have done.

 

I would really like to hear HONEST answers from all here. What would you have done and, more importantly to me, why?

 

He should have gone to class. I can't see anything that excuses not going to class.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think Bubba won. He couldn't have graduated from ASU, so I reckon his lack of a degree is the biggest fallout from this. He acknowledged flunking school was a big mistake, so that wasn't his best move. If he transfers, he loses credits so he probably won't graduate that route either. Also unlikely that he would have graduated in four years from PSU.

His best bet was to make sure he didn't get certified for 149 and then hope Cael picks his brother over his favorite child and allow the redshirt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't think Bubba won. He couldn't have graduated from ASU, so I reckon his lack of a degree is the biggest fallout from this. He acknowledged flunking school was a big mistake, so that wasn't his best move. If he transfers, he loses credits so he probably won't graduate that route either. Also unlikely that he would have graduated in four years from PSU.

His best bet was to make sure he didn't get certified for 149 and then hope Cael picks his brother over his favorite child and allow the redshirt.

 

Its possible he already had a degree from PSU, he was there for a full four years

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't think Bubba won. He couldn't have graduated from ASU, so I reckon his lack of a degree is the biggest fallout from this. He acknowledged flunking school was a big mistake, so that wasn't his best move. If he transfers, he loses credits so he probably won't graduate that route either. Also unlikely that he would have graduated in four years from PSU.

His best bet was to make sure he didn't get certified for 149 and then hope Cael picks his brother over his favorite child and allow the redshirt.

 

Its possible he already had a degree from PSU, he was there for a full four years, and the classes he failed may not have been degree relevent

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Molinaro vs Bubba thread made me start to really think what I would have done in Bubba's shoes. SHP said that all here agree that there was plenty of wrong done on BOTH sides. I do NOT like what Bubba did, but I don't see what ELSE he could have done.

 

I would really like to hear HONEST answers from all here. What would you have done and, more importantly to me, why?

 

To me he had 2 legit options.

 

1. Wrestle 149 for his senior year like the coaches wanted him to and which would have been the best option for the team.

2. If he wasn't willing to do #1 then transfer immediately.

 

What he did instead was flunk classes on purposes to be academically ineligible the first semester and then miss weight at 157 for Mat Town and wrestle anyway at 165 so he wasn't eligible to wrestle 149 that season no matter what, guaranteeing he got the redshirt he wanted.

 

Here's a question back at you and I'd appreciate an honest answer. What would you have done with a wrestler who did the above things if you were coach?

 

Why shouldn't he have been given the option to wrestle off at 157 against Cyler? Telling people they have to cut weight is a dangerous mentality, especially considering Bubba was their best wrestler at the weight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Molinaro vs Bubba thread made me start to really think what I would have done in Bubba's shoes. SHP said that all here agree that there was plenty of wrong done on BOTH sides. I do NOT like what Bubba did, but I don't see what ELSE he could have done.

 

I would really like to hear HONEST answers from all here. What would you have done and, more importantly to me, why?

 

To me he had 2 legit options.

 

1. Wrestle 149 for his senior year like the coaches wanted him to and which would have been the best option for the team.

2. If he wasn't willing to do #1 then transfer immediately.

 

What he did instead was flunk classes on purposes to be academically ineligible the first semester and then miss weight at 157 for Mat Town and wrestle anyway at 165 so he wasn't eligible to wrestle 149 that season no matter what, guaranteeing he got the redshirt he wanted.

 

Here's a question back at you and I'd appreciate an honest answer. What would you have done with a wrestler who did the above things if you were coach?

 

1. It was my understanding that he was told prior to Sanderson's arrival that he was allowed to RS and wrestle 157 the following year. Sanderson nixed this. I truly don't believe Jenkins could have held 149 for that year and would have been a non factor at the NCAA tournament. Great option for him, don't you think?

 

2. Was he given the option to transfer immediately? Did he really want to leave PSU with only 1 year left?

 

 

You are asking me a question, presuming A LOT. First off, as a coach I would NOT have let it get that far. I would have found a way to Co-exist. I would have honored someone who had already put in 3 years to the program prior to my first year as their coach. Obviously that didn't play out that way.......

 

If, and that is a very UNLIKELY if, Sanderson actually gave him a chance to transfer prior to what Jenkins did, I would have done what Sanderson did. However, Bubba doing what he did, already having the option to transfer, makes NO sense. I truly believe Sanderson FORCED him into that corner and that was the only way Jenkins figured he could get out of that corner.

 

So to honestly answer your question, I can't really answer your question the way it was asked. I wouldn't have been the guy that forced him into that corner in the first place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

penn state told him he would get a redshirt and five years on scholarship

 

Really? You know it was put to him in that way? I always thought scholarships were 1 year at a time and renewable. You are implying they are for not just four years, but five, and unconditional.

 

Now, I know loads of wrestlers end up getting five years, but I don't see anywhere where this is a requirement that if you offer a kid scholarship money that it is owed for five years and without any conditions, like, say, going to classes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is Bubba's Career Big10 and NCAA track record before Cael arrived.

 

14-6 in Big10 duals

7-6 Big10 Championships

5-5 NCAA Championships

 

Do you build around a kid like Bubba, or do you build around a kid like Taylor. No brainer if you ask me, and for Penn State it has worked out really well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll tell you one thing, you're going to get all the usual suspects saying Cael did the right thing. (TBar beat me to it!!!) What Bubba should not have done is stay there and take it in the.....backside. You're going to get the PSU fans saying Cael was in the right and plenty of non-PSU fans saying he screwed Bubba over. Never going to change anyone's mind on either side. Bubba got his title and torched Taylor in the process. I'd say it worked out great for both sides. That's not to say it was handled correctly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Here is Bubba's Career Big10 and NCAA track record before Cael arrived.

 

14-6 in Big10 duals

7-6 Big10 Championships

5-5 NCAA Championships

 

Do you build around a kid like Bubba, or do you build around a kid like Taylor. No brainer if you ask me, and for Penn State it has worked out really well.

 

LOL, how many of those losses were in his true freshman year or to Metcalf? Did Taylor wrestle his true freshman year? Did he wrestle someone at Metcalf's level multiple times his first 2 years of competition that would have been equivalent to Jenkins' true sophomore and junior years? Did Taylor wrestle NCAA's with a significant injury one year? Inevitably your argument holds no value as Sanderson inherited Jenkins with 1 year of eligibility remaining (excluding the RS option) vs. Taylor with his 4+1(RS).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Here is Bubba's Career Big10 and NCAA track record before Cael arrived.

 

14-6 in Big10 duals

7-6 Big10 Championships

5-5 NCAA Championships

 

Do you build around a kid like Bubba, or do you build around a kid like Taylor. No brainer if you ask me, and for Penn State it has worked out really well.

When did people start building their program around a senior? His final NCAA record is 10-5 with a bonus point win in his last match?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Here is Bubba's Career Big10 and NCAA track record before Cael arrived.

 

14-6 in Big10 duals

7-6 Big10 Championships

5-5 NCAA Championships

 

Do you build around a kid like Bubba, or do you build around a kid like Taylor. No brainer if you ask me, and for Penn State it has worked out really well.

When did people start building their program around a senior? His final NCAA record is 10-5 with a bonus point win in his last match?

 

exactly

 

lets get back to the reason cael needed his scholarship freed up and wanted him gone in four years not there for a fifth

 

you can take over a team and honor the commitment made to the athletes you inherited and build your team a little slower or you can cast them to the side like cael did

 

cael needed bubbas scholarship for the alton twins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Couple things here:

 

1. Jake Kemerer was supposed to be the guy at 165 the following season so Sanderson wanted this lineup for his first year:

 

141: Molinaro

149: Jenkins

157: Sanderson

165: Vallimont

 

and the following season:

 

149: Molinaro

157: Taylor

165: Kemerer

 

2. Jenkins did not graduate from Penn State. If he did, he wouldn't of needed a release. The reality of the situation was Jenkins was academically ineligible the second semester when he transferred out.

 

3. Jenkins was pulled out of redshirt his freshman year by Sunderland. This was considered completely unnecessary by many PSU fans and a waste of a year of eligibility. This also caused Nathan Galloway to transfer out.

 

4. Jenkins and Sanderson had conflicting personalities. Most people have figured this one out but seem to lose site if the fact the head coach is supposed to win this battle. The tail isn't supposed to wag the dog. Not only was Bubba failing classes, he intentionally missed weight at the ESU Open to eliminate the possibly of wrestling at 149 under the NCAA weight management rules. These actions would have ANY coach looking to part ways.

 

5. In light of the redshirt issue, maybe Cael should of gave Bubba a general release instead of one with all the restrictions as to what schools he could transfer to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Couple things here:

 

1. Jake Kemerer was supposed to be the guy at 165 the following season so Sanderson wanted this lineup for his first year:

 

141: Molinaro

149: Jenkins

157: Sanderson

165: Vallimont

 

2. Jenkins did not graduate from Penn State. If he did, he wouldn't of needed a release. The reality of the situation was Jenkins was academically ineligible the second semester when he transferred out.

 

3. Jenkins was pulled out of redshirt his freshman year by Sunderland. This was considered completely unnecessary by many PSU fans and a waste of a year of eligibility.

 

4. Jenkins and Sanderson had conflicting personalities. Most people have figured this one out but seem to lose site if the fact the head coach is supposed to win this battle. The tail isn't supposed to wag the dog. Not only was Bubba failing classes, he intentionally missed weight at the ESU Open to eliminate the possibly of wrestling at 149. These actions would have ANY coach looking to part ways.

 

5. In light of the redshirt issue, maybe Cael should of gave Bubba a general release instead of one with all the restrictions as to what schools he could transfer to.

 

I think Bubba leaving helped Molinaro. He looked strong at 149.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Here is Bubba's Career Big10 and NCAA track record before Cael arrived.

 

14-6 in Big10 duals

7-6 Big10 Championships

5-5 NCAA Championships

 

Do you build around a kid like Bubba, or do you build around a kid like Taylor. No brainer if you ask me, and for Penn State it has worked out really well.

When did people start building their program around a senior? His final NCAA record is 10-5 with a bonus point win in his last match?

 

Yeah, but this was Cael's first year and he had to build around something. On the one hand he has a guy who purposely fails classes and blows his cert at 149 and he can either reward him for doing that OR, knowing his team isn't going to win anything that year anyway, build for the future. I'd say Cael made the right choice.

 

If Cael rewarded Bubba there, we might not have 3 NCAA titles right now. Worked out really well for Penn State.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...