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Tim Flynn-COTY

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A tidbit about 2 of Flynns 3 champs.... King won it as the 12 seed and Gillespie as the 5 seed...

 

Interesting. Once those guys won the title, it was proven that they were elite wrestlers who could contend for the title every year. Under Flynn these guys weren't able to win the title again or get back to the finals. After Gillespie won his title, he placed 5th and 4th the next two years. King placed third after winning, and so did Koscheck. I merely point this out to show that it's not as easy as it seems to many to get your top guys to stay on top.

 

Do you think Cael is upset about this award? Do you think he would say Flynn is not deserving? But more importantly do you think Cael even believes that Flynn or any of the other top coaches would not have been able to get Taylor or Ruth more than one title?

 

But let's play your game.

 

-Andrew Alton looked primed to be a All-American finishing R12 as a true freshman in the toughest weight but never got closer and regressed

-Taylor won as a sophomore dominating everyone while being undefeated and lost twice as a junior with no title

-Andrew Long made the finals at Iowa State but then Cael only got him third

-Ruth went undefeated and dominated everyone as a junior and took a loss as a senior

-Dylan Alton was an All-American but then couldn't make the podium

-Matt Brown made the finals and was anticipated by many to win a title but placed fifth

-Mega made the finals and then placed third

 

That's just talking about the guys that made the starting lineup not talking about the recruits that didn't pan out.

 

All these guys were proven to be elite as you say and were unable to follow that up the next year does that mean Cael isn't a good coach? Stop already.

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I think this guy is driving everyone crazy, sounds like a cry baby that got his toy stollen. Relax, everyone thinks Cael is an awesome coach. PSU won NCAA's... Flynn deserved COTY without question. Think about what an average person at home would think when tuning into the NCAA's and seeing Edinboro in the top 5?! I think both coaches are great for the sport. Flynn is great at finding those darkhorse recruits too.

 

Superold is not a Penn State fan. He is a garden-variety troll. His argument has nothing to do with having his toy stolen. If Sanderson had won, he would be arguing for Tim Flynn.

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I think this guy is driving everyone crazy, sounds like a cry baby that got his toy stollen. Relax, everyone thinks Cael is an awesome coach. PSU won NCAA's... Flynn deserved COTY without question. Think about what an average person at home would think when tuning into the NCAA's and seeing Edinboro in the top 5?! I think both coaches are great for the sport. Flynn is great at finding those darkhorse recruits too.

 

Superold is not a Penn State fan. He is a garden-variety troll. His argument has nothing to do with having his toy stolen. If Sanderson had won, he would be arguing for Tim Flynn.

 

No, I'm not a troll PhiferFuqua. Please stop with the name calling. For the record, I wouldn't consider, even for a second, voting for Flynn after what he did this season at Edinboro. I'm not taking anything away from him, he's a good coach.

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The NWCA stipulates that a Coach of the Year winner can not receive the award in consecutive years, something like a 3 year gap between COTY award time frame. So if Cael did win last year then this why he wasn't eligible to win in 2014.

Reason being that the NWCA is trying to hi-light the coaches who are doing a great job not necessarily the guy whose team wins each year. I think it is a good rule for the award, I honest don't believe Coach Sanderson or Coach Robinson are losing any sleep over it.

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The NWCA stipulates that a Coach of the Year winner can not receive the award in consecutive years, something like a 3 year gap between COTY award time frame. So if Cael did win last year then this why he wasn't eligible to win in 2014.

Reason being that the NWCA is trying to hi-light the coaches who are doing a great job not necessarily the guy whose team wins each year. I think it is a good rule for the award, I honest don't believe Coach Sanderson or Coach Robinson are losing any sleep over it.

Six year gap. So, for instance, Tim Flynn will next be eligible in 2020.

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Personally, I think Cael does not develop talent that well. He gets incredible recruits that walk onto campus and are very high AA level their freshman year. But, taking good wrestlers and making them great is not his strength IMO. Now that Ruth and Taylor are gone it will be a good indicator of his true development ability. Please understand, I am not a Cael hater nor a basher, just my observation.

 

Last year with Taylor, Ruth AND Q, the field was more distant from PSU, this year, w/o Q, the field got closer. Legit question, has Cael coached a national champ at PSU that he recruited and did not bring from ISU or a prior ISU commit? I can only think of Nico making it to the finals twice, and that is as close as it comes. I could be wrong though. Nico and Retherford had legit NC chances this year and neither made the finals. I would have thought the Alton boys would have had 2-3 nat championships between them by now as well. McIntosh has two more chances, but may never get there as well with the young 197lbs looking tough.

 

thoughts?

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Personally, I think Cael does not develop talent that well. He gets incredible recruits that walk onto campus and are very high AA level their freshman year. But, taking good wrestlers and making them great is not his strength IMO. Now that Ruth and Taylor are gone it will be a good indicator of his true development ability. Please understand, I am not a Cael hater nor a basher, just my observation.

 

Last year with Taylor, Ruth AND Q, the field was more distant from PSU, this year, w/o Q, the field got closer. Legit question, has Cael coached a national champ at PSU that he recruited and did not bring from ISU or a prior ISU commit? I can only think of Nico making it to the finals twice, and that is as close as it comes. I could be wrong though. Nico and Retherford had legit NC chances this year and neither made the finals. I would have thought the Alton boys would have had 2-3 nat championships between them by now as well. McIntosh has two more chances, but may never get there as well with the young 197lbs looking tough.

 

thoughts?

 

That's a little unfair.

 

Why shouldn't Cael get credit for Jake Varner and Trent Paulson, both NCAA champs? And what about Backes, who definitely improved, although he was "just" an AA. He had only modest success at ISU, but he was certainly the coach there and should get full credit for those guys.

 

At PSU, what about guys like English, Conaway, and Beitz? They're never going to be NCAA champs, no matter who coaches them, but they certainly improved quite a bit under Cael.

 

The reality is that you're half right and half wrong. Yes, Cael gets the best recruits, no question. Maybe two or three other guys in the world will ever get as many guys like Taylor, Ruth, Megaludis, Retherford, etc. And yes, he has had some spectacular flops, most notably the Altons (who ever thought that one of them would NOT be the starter in his fourth year in college??).

 

But he has also done his fair share of talent development.

 

Personally, I feel what Flynn did this year was hands down more impressive, but Cael was at worst a top three or four coach this year by any standard, and he is the best coach since taking over at PSU. How much of that was Cael vs. PSU, we'll never know, but to say that it was all PSU is as wrong as to give Cael all the credit.

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It is great for our sport that a coach from a little school gets the Coach of Year Award! Cael Sanderson did a great job as well but him winning doesn't get the little schools the same recognition. Tim Flynn is a class act and well deserved. Congrats to Timmy for COY and Cael for winning the team title!

On a side note: The coaching tree at the Boro is pretty good since Tim has been there. Isn't that a true sign of someone's coaching ability?

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A tidbit about 2 of Flynns 3 champs.... King won it as the 12 seed and Gillespie as the 5 seed...

 

Interesting. Once those guys won the title, it was proven that they were elite wrestlers who could contend for the title every year. Under Flynn these guys weren't able to win the title again or get back to the finals. After Gillespie won his title, he placed 5th and 4th the next two years. King placed third after winning, and so did Koscheck. I merely point this out to show that it's not as easy as it seems to many to get your top guys to stay on top.

 

Do you think Cael is upset about this award? Do you think he would say Flynn is not deserving? But more importantly do you think Cael even believes that Flynn or any of the other top coaches would not have been able to get Taylor or Ruth more than one title?

 

But let's play your game.

 

-Andrew Alton looked primed to be a All-American finishing R12 as a true freshman in the toughest weight but never got closer and regressed

-Taylor won as a sophomore dominating everyone while being undefeated and lost twice as a junior with no title

-Andrew Long made the finals at Iowa State but then Cael only got him third

-Ruth went undefeated and dominated everyone as a junior and took a loss as a senior

-Dylan Alton was an All-American but then couldn't make the podium

-Matt Brown made the finals and was anticipated by many to win a title but placed fifth

-Mega made the finals and then placed third

 

That's just talking about the guys that made the starting lineup not talking about the recruits that didn't pan out.

 

All these guys were proven to be elite as you say and were unable to follow that up the next year does that mean Cael isn't a good coach? Stop already.

 

Dutchcountry, I think you are missing the point of my posts. Try reading what I said again.

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