Bite the Hand that Feeds

[LongShot 13]

Anyone catch Flo's article ripping the ESPN commentating? Not a great idea or at least not the way to go about it.

[Pinnum 671]

"For those at ESPN, the NCAA Tournament is nothing more than a "business as usual" type of outing -at least it seems that way."

 

It seems like that was suppose to be a criticism but I think that is ESPN's strength! They run so many events that this is just another event for them.

 

It is easy to play morning quarterback...

[Glane18 65]

Must be a little slow around the Flo office. I disagree with their viewpoint of ESPN and I think they are being a little too sensitive about the issue. The coverage was absolutely amazing this year and overall, viewership increased, which is good for our sport.

[BobDole 846]

There are mistakes on every NFL broadcast... quite frankly there are mistakes on all sports broadcasts.

[dutchcountry7 26]

Flow's niche is not quality but being a bunch of hip kids. They are all pretty immature and the kids eat it up. Not saying this is a bad thing because it has a lot of kids interested in wrestling and watching college wrestling. But you would think there would be some adult who would act as oversight on what is put out from this company but they aren't really journalist they are more of a social club.

 

Clearly this is a young kid that wrote this and Flow clearly want to be able to say they are the biggest and best wrestling media company in the world despite continuing to take a back seat to television networks.

 

It is as if they don't see how this could get them blackballed by ESPN which could result in the NCAA giving them even less access. "Crushing them like the little cockroaches they are"

 

It really reminds me of those ONE UPPERS you hear about who always chime in with why they are better no matter what is said.

[DocRevue 0]

It's not really biting the hand that feeds because ESPN actually does want to know what it can do better - it wants to know what can be improved to increase its viewership and the fan experience. If these criticisms came from an actual competitor, ESPN might be a bit sensitive, but they don't.

 

That said, wow are most of these huge stretches. I agree that Amin is not perfect and that he knows very little about wrestling but he is professional and he learns - he doesn't make the same mistakes over and over again. I watch a lot of sports and the ONLY play-by-play guy I've ever seen who can own a broadcast of a sport that is not his bread-and-butter is Al Michaels. Amin is no Al Michaels but he does a more than adequate job considering the subtle complexities of folkstyle wrestling. Mistakes happen during every broadcast and they are very easy to pick out when you know a sport inside and out like the Flo guys. A college basketball fanatic would have a similar criticism of NCAA basketball tourney broadcasts.

 

Given the staggering number of matches to call and decisions to make during the course of this tournament, ESPN must have done a pretty good job if these were the biggest gripes Flo could find with the broadcast.

[Billyhoyle 1,699]

This article is a joke. A couple of the ESPN3 commentators were pretty bad on the non-marquee mats, but it was made up for by Shane Sparks and a couple of others who are way beyond anything FLO has ever produced in terms of quality. Has anyone ever listened to a FLO play by play? They essentially are just yelling the entire time...That is not how you professionally call a sporting event for a wide audience.

 

When it got time for the prime time announcing on the Fri and Sat night sessions...Yes, the commentators were "dumbing down" their analyses, but this is a good thing! We're trying to expand viewership to those outside the "flo subscriber" community. Then, of course, there's no mention of the "Off the mat" commentary that was offered on ESPN3 during the finals....Which honestly was probably the best "expert" analysis ever provided for a wrestling broadcast (Gable, Kemp, Burroughs, Dake, Koll...It was fun).

 

It seems to me that Flowrestling is a bit jealous that their coverage is nowhere in the ballpark of BTDN and ESPN.

[RSabich 9]

Dutch: Couldn't agree more. And to those complaining about Baldwin, their are people who may have stuck around for the medal rounds just because he was involved.

 

As a former wrestler and Lacrosse player I think Quint Kessenich does a great job with both sports in the limited time they give him. Robles does a good job for someone so new, too.

 

And more of Shane Sparks!

[Glane18 65]

BTW, does anybody remember Martin announcing matches? Lol.

[BobDole 846]

WHAT?!? WHAT?!? WHAAAAAT?!?

[lil_red 1]

I would say the Flow boys do more for ESPN than ESPN does for them. Because of the great coverage and behind the scene footage you see all year, there is now more interest to see these athletes compete on the biggest stage (step in ESPN). Flo has earned the right, with years of hard work, to say a few things about ESPN coverage how to improve upon it. Flo boys have paid their dues and don't get enough of the credit.

 

Flo personalities are great also. They can be a little loud during tournament coverage at times but I think this has even gotten a lot better. Personally, I want to know who is traveling to Russia or the Olympics and to see what their experience is like. If it was just wrestling matches all the time flowrestling would not be what it is. ESPN does the same thing, personalities sell ESPN radio shows and television. The idea that these are a bunch of kids on some random site is ridiculous.

 

If my $100 or so bucks a year helps these guys travel to Russia / World Championships / NCAA Championships / Many great High School Wrestling tournaments than I am happy to contribute.

[zeeb 0]

Not only is ESPN not the hand that feeds Flo, it is a competitor. If ESPN didn't own the broadcasting rights to the NCAA Championships Flo would be able to make a killing broadcasting it.

[BobDole 846]

Not only is ESPN not the hand that feeds Flo, it is a competitor. If ESPN didn't own the broadcasting rights to the NCAA Championships Flo would be able to make a killing broadcasting it.

 

That is like saying my home brewing operation is a competitor to Budweiser.

[JBluegill133 237]

WHAT?!? WHAT?!? WHAAAAAT?!?

 

 

+1 I spit my mountain dew on my computer screen when i read this. I could literally hear Martin's voice screaming that in my head when i read that. Good form.

[zeeb 0]

Not only is ESPN not the hand that feeds Flo, it is a competitor. If ESPN didn't own the broadcasting rights to the NCAA Championships Flo would be able to make a killing broadcasting it.

 

That is like saying my home brewing operation is a competitor to Budweiser.

 

More comparable to say that your local craft brewery is a competitor to Budweiser. They're on completely different levels of scale, but they're still selling the same thing.

[wrestlingphish 538]

Not only is ESPN not the hand that feeds Flo, it is a competitor. If ESPN didn't own the broadcasting rights to the NCAA Championships Flo would be able to make a killing broadcasting it.

 

And exactly what channel would they broadcast it on?

[dutchcountry7 26]

I watched the flow NCAA highlight video. It was pretty cool but the commentary was painful. Would someone please point me to a video where Flow had some good commentary?

 

"If ESPN didn't own the broadcasting rights to the NCAA Championships Flo would be able to make a killing broadcasting it."

 

Yup if ESPN didn't pay big money for broadcast rights Flow would make a killing off it. Like if I owned a diamond mine I would make a killing off it. Stupid DeBeers! :lol:

[zeeb 0]

And exactly what channel would they broadcast it on?

 

The same channel they broadcast dozens of tournaments every season. A subscription based Internet stream.

 

Yup if ESPN didn't pay big money for broadcast rights Flow would make a killing off it. Like if I owned a diamond mine I would make a killing off it. Stupid DeBeers! :lol:

 

Except your example isn't at all comparable. Flo regularly streams wrestling tournaments and if they could afford the rights there's about a 100% chance that they'd cover NCAAs just like they covered several conference tournaments. They have the equipment, expertise, and personnel to offer live coverage of wrestling tournaments. ESPN, the Big Ten Network, The Pac-12 Network, individual colleges that offer streams of their events... these are all competitors to FloWrestling. Just because Flo is smaller than them doesn't mean they don't compete against them. Just like my example from earlier, your local small microbrew isn't a major player in the world market for beer. But they do compete against every other brewer out there.

[gimpeltf 963]

Wasn't Flo shooting the streams that ESPN showed?

[BobDole 846]

No they weren't. ESPN had their own cameras on the mats.

[silverfoxwc 6]

First, Do we need to revisit all the threads about Flo not being able to handle streaming events and all the issues with them from billing to dead feeds? And that is what you want for the biggest tournament of the year?

 

Second, I have never watched a flow match without the mute on. Their commentary is obnoxious and horribly annoying. I don't even visit flo anymore because they are so annoying. Like someone said, they are immature which appeals to the younger kids. And perhaps that is the demographic they sought out and do not care what the rest of us think. Problem is, kids don't have money.

[BobDole 846]

And exactly what channel would they broadcast it on?

 

The same channel they broadcast dozens of tournaments every season. A subscription based Internet stream.

 

Yup if ESPN didn't pay big money for broadcast rights Flow would make a killing off it. Like if I owned a diamond mine I would make a killing off it. Stupid DeBeers! :lol:

 

Except your example isn't at all comparable. Flo regularly streams wrestling tournaments and if they could afford the rights there's about a 100% chance that they'd cover NCAAs just like they covered several conference tournaments. They have the equipment, expertise, and personnel to offer live coverage of wrestling tournaments. ESPN, the Big Ten Network, The Pac-12 Network, individual colleges that offer streams of their events... these are all competitors to FloWrestling. Just because Flo is smaller than them doesn't mean they don't compete against them. Just like my example from earlier, your local small microbrew isn't a major player in the world market for beer. But they do compete against every other brewer out there.

You really want Flo to broadcast the NCAA Finals? Were you not aware of the issues they had with almost any event they have streamed? Also are you not aware of the billing issues they have?

 

No better way to kill the sport than have a stream that is flaky and have people being bills years after the event.

[gimpeltf 963]

No they weren't. ESPN had their own cameras on the mats.

Both were filming? My understanding is that you could see Flo logos on the computers at matside and you can see the matches on Flo Premium.

[ccrider55 16]

This article is a joke. A couple of the ESPN3 commentators were pretty bad on the non-marquee mats, but it was made up for by Shane Sparks and a couple of others who are way beyond anything FLO has ever produced in terms of quality. Has anyone ever listened to a FLO play by play? They essentially are just yelling the entire time...That is not how you professionally call a sporting event for a wide audience.

 

When it got time for the prime time announcing on the Fri and Sat night sessions...Yes, the commentators were "dumbing down" their analyses, but this is a good thing! We're trying to expand viewership to those outside the "flo subscriber" community. Then, of course, there's no mention of the "Off the mat" commentary that was offered on ESPN3 during the finals....Which honestly was probably the best "expert" analysis ever provided for a wrestling broadcast (Gable, Kemp, Burroughs, Dake, Koll...It was fun).

 

It seems to me that Flowrestling is a bit jealous that their coverage is nowhere in the ballpark of BTDN and ESPN.

I disagree with dumbing down being a good thing. There was less dumbing down in the Wide World of Sports days. Top, front line sportscaster (Jim McKay, Al Michaels?) who themselves had a reasonable wrestling understanding would briefly summarize the scoring and then commentate like they did a FB game. Dumbing down turns it into a "here's an unpopular sport, let's learn something about it together" event, rather than rather than "here's a great, exciting championship. For those who don't know, here is the scoring - and now the matches!" I'm not crazy about the scoring summary, but the graphic and time taken should be under 15 seconds. When is the last time the scoring in FB, Basketball, or Baseball were repeated multiple times a day?...or ever, if there hasn't been a very recent change? It diminishes the sport. Broadcasters should treat whatever even modestly popular (number of HS participants a good guide) events as if most of the audience is knowledgable, and probably former and current participants.

 

PS: this is my only complaint, and although it bugs me, I'll put up with it gladly for the amount, quality, and multi platform availability. I have many disagreements with the Mother Ship of sports, but they made inroads in that with this coverage.

[sockobuw 49]

No they weren't. ESPN had their own cameras on the mats.

Both were filming? My understanding is that you could see Flo logos on the computers at matside and you can see the matches on Flo Premium.

 

saturday morning was the only session i noticed flo guys at the tables. they were recording the feed that was for video review.