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Euro's GR Scoring ?

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the refs 1st made a mess for leaving red down too long in the 1st period. red's passive, blue on top. the ref leave's red down for over 20 sec. before blue gets a lock.

 

the flurry in question was butchered worse. correct scoring

4 red

2 red

1 blue, is questionable.

there should be no scoring for blue. blue never stopped red or changed his direction. blue slowed red but in no way earned 2.

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The score they disagree on is a judgment call - did the defender counter or not? I think most referees would see that as a successful counter, because the attacker was stuck on his back for a count or so before completing the move.

 

With international wrestling, it is what it is: sometimes the scoring is a little subjective.

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Doesn't it say something about the rules though when two posters as knowledgable as gutfirst and olddirty can't even agree on a scoring sequence?

 

I believe that gutfirst may not understand the new rules. Before every major international tournament, FILA emails each federation of how the rules will be called. For this rule, they were very clear: When you roll a guy over your own back and he pauses you, just for a second, its either 2-1 on the ground or 4-2 from the feet. I have no doubt that he countered him enough to cause a slight pause. Whether or not all refs across the world are consistent with this is another issue.

 

The only thing questionable here is the push out call. I think it was the correct call. Blue was grounded, but red was not when he stepped out with both feet.

 

The 1pt was not for a pushout, it was for a failed challenge.

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Before sequence it is

 

Blue - Red

5 - 0

* Red - 4 point throw

5-4

* Red hits 2 point exposure, but is held briefly, 1 point blue

6-6

* Blue is given two more points?? Where are these points from?

 

Olddirty, could you reconcile this for me:

2 red - exposure/2 blue exposure. Blue momentarily counters red and puts him on his back, then red rolls him through.

 

When you roll a guy over your own back and he pauses you, just for a second, its either 2-1 on the ground

 

I assume you are saying those are different scenarios? If so, I would think the match the match was scored correctly at 2-1, not 2-2 as you indicated.

 

But where does the other 2 come from?

 

Maybe they scored in the wrong order, but somehow Blue gets 3 points in this sequence (before challenge) and I'm not sure where they come from. The only logical explanation would be they scored the second exposure 2-2 and then awarded blue a point for red step out (which was not the case, red's hand may have been out first, but blue's elbow hit before red's knee).

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[The only logical explanation would be they scored the second exposure 2-2 and then awarded blue a point for red step out

 

 

Okay, I can grasp this sequence now. Does anyone understand the challenge? It went from 8-6 blue to 9-8 blue. It looks like red received another 2pts during the challenge, so where does red's 1pt come from?

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Before sequence it is

 

Blue - Red

5 - 0

* Red - 4 point throw

5-4

* Red hits 2 point exposure, but is held briefly, 1 point blue

6-6

* Blue is given two more points?? Where are these points from?

 

Olddirty, could you reconcile this for me:

2 red - exposure/2 blue exposure. Blue momentarily counters red and puts him on his back, then red rolls him through.

 

When you roll a guy over your own back and he pauses you, just for a second, its either 2-1 on the ground

 

I assume you are saying those are different scenarios? If so, I would think the match the match was scored correctly at 2-1, not 2-2 as you indicated.

 

But where does the other 2 come from?

 

 

Yes, you have it almost correct. The rule is if you pause them just barely for a second, its either 2-1 (from ground) or 4-2 (from feet). However, if you legitimately counter them and hold them, its 2-2. The refs thought it was a counter where red initiates a move, and blue counters, but both roll over their backs. Just like the old 2-2 scoring.

 

I would tend to agreewith the refs on this one because I could tell exactly what blue was doing there. He was taking his untrapped arm and wrapping reds back to hold him. He didnt do a very good job and it was 50/50, but I knew what he was doing. I would not argue with anyone who says it should have been 2-0.

 

I was wrong, they did award a point to blue for "correct throw" on the edge, which I also agree with. He wraps reds arms, hits a full back arch, but fails to score backs or a takedown. This is another rule they just implemented and put an emphasis on.

 

Red challenges and loses for another 1. Cant blame him because the score keeper was so slow getting the points up.

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Red challenges and loses for another 1. Cant blame him because the score keeper was so slow getting the points up.

 

So Red was winning 8-8 when he challenged, the lost the challenge and ended up losing 9-8?

 

I love the cube throwing, but with all of the refs and confirmations it can get pretty confusing exactly how many points you've already earned.

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od,

 

i don't disagree with your interpretations of the rule for the countering guy to score. i disagree that blue stopped or paused red at any time. both wrestlers continued to move throughout the attempt and exposure. i think we can agree that slowing the guy down doesn't merit points. 2 blue was a mistake and i suspect the crew on the mat heard about it.

 

trying to legislate the offensive wrestler to turn cleanly happens every 8-10 years or so. i think awarding the defensive wrestler points will happen less and less as the season goes on. within 2 or 3 events the nonsense will stop.

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od,

 

i don't disagree with your interpretations of the rule for the countering guy to score. i disagree that blue stopped or paused red at any time. both wrestlers continued to move throughout the attempt and exposure. i think we can agree that slowing the guy down doesn't merit points. 2 blue was a mistake and i suspect the crew on the mat heard about it.

 

trying to legislate the offensive wrestler to turn cleanly happens every 8-10 years or so. i think awarding the defensive wrestler points will happen less and less as the season goes on. within 2 or 3 events the nonsense will stop.

 

I think you are right. They are working the kinks out right now and it shows. I dont agree with it either, but thats how it is being enforced right now.

 

I disagree on him defending though. If he wasnt defending, then why would red change directions mid turn like that? I will tell you why: Blue got his arm around the waist and defended. Again, I can see your argument but I have done that defense a thousand times and knew exactly what he was doing. I do not believe the intentions of the rule when it was made was to award points in situations like that though.

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