Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Wahawk90

Brands

Recommended Posts

We all know dominate the Brands bros were in college. Do you guys think they would be as dominate today as they were then? They were not turners but were superior on their feet but they didn't have to deal with guys that were scramblers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tony Ramos was an NCAA champion at Terry's weight. Is there any question that Terry Brands would beat Ramos to a pulp? Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

 

Tom versus Stieber is a different and more interesting question. It is very hard to pick that one. I personally believe Alan Fried was as good as Stieber is now and probably better. And Brands didn't quite own Fried but was the significant favorite. I know the transitive property doesn't work in wrestling, etc. etc. I just think junior or senior Tom would beat junior Stieber but it would be very close.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Ia_hawk I do know the difference but since I can't make my secretary proof read my post I look like an idiot :)

 

Stieber against Brands would be a great match because Steiber actually looks better on his feet than he did when he was a fresh/soph.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
@Ia_hawk I do know the difference but since I can't make my secretary proof read my post I look like an idiot :)

 

I want your job just so I can ask my "administrative assistant" to proof read for me to see the reaction. If s/he is cool with it, I'll train him/her to troll other boards that don't have populations as intelligent as this one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
@Ia_hawk I do know the difference but since I can't make my secretary proof read my post I look like an idiot :)

We Iowans used to be a literate lot. My 3rd grade teaching in C.R. is rolling in her grave.

Maybe your secretary should proof these posts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure I buy your premise that the Brands competed against sub-par competition:

 

Alan Fried was a pretty darn good wrestler.

 

Dave Zuniga of Minnesota gave Tom Brands fits.

 

Then there was future gold medalist, Kendall Cross, whose nickname was "Gumby" and had some funk.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There was an interview where Fried said that Brands wasn't very dominant, he just appeared to be because he won a lot. It wasn't disparaging, he just observed that Brands didn't really trounce guys like Sanderson or Smith did, and that with him it was blood and guts every round at every tournament, and in each match there was an opportunity for him to lose. He attributed that to Brands being so motivated and how Iowa's teams in those days were able to grind out close wins and then without any let down be ready to do it over and over. I thought that was pretty interesting.

 

"That’s why I think he was so tough, every year in the U.S. Open he would be in a match he was on the verge of losing, but he would come up with something completely unrehearsed that he would pull out of the depths of his amazing will to win.

 

He wrestled way over his head all the time. People think Brands dominated because he always won. He didn’t. Every time, there was sometime where he definitely could have lost but didn’t. It wasn’t like Smith or Sanderson, you know, just pretty much trouncing every single person. It was blood and guts every round. He was just so motivated. That’s how much respect I have for him. And, the thing about him and most of the Iowa guys on his level was that if they got into a match that went down to the wire in an early round, they were ready to do the same thing the next round."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tony Ramos was an NCAA champion at Terry's weight. Is there any question that Terry Brands would beat Ramos to a pulp? Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

 

Tom versus Stieber is a different and more interesting question. It is very hard to pick that one. I personally believe Alan Fried was as good as Stieber is now and probably better. And Brands didn't quite own Fried but was the significant favorite. I know the transitive property doesn't work in wrestling, etc. etc. I just think junior or senior Tom would beat junior Stieber but it would be very close.

 

I appreciate the talent that Alan Fried was, but to just kind of dismiss Logan's possible (probable) superiority because I am guessing he is closer to your time is kind of like people who have tell you back in my day, 6 feet of snow, 2 miles uphill I walked to school and then the world reversed and I had the same exact challenge just to get home.

 

Logan as a probable 4 time champion gets my nod as probably the better talent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe those of us that watched both wrestle 15 matches or so have more insight, maybe not. Brands was a special kind of beast. I don't know who I would take, I'd pay a hundred bucks just to see them both in their prime wrestle a best of 5 series. Fried/Stieber would be equally entertaining.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tony Ramos was an NCAA champion at Terry's weight. Is there any question that Terry Brands would beat Ramos to a pulp? Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

 

Tom versus Stieber is a different and more interesting question. It is very hard to pick that one. I personally believe Alan Fried was as good as Stieber is now and probably better. And Brands didn't quite own Fried but was the significant favorite. I know the transitive property doesn't work in wrestling, etc. etc. I just think junior or senior Tom would beat junior Stieber but it would be very close.

 

Wrestlingnerd, you owe Stieber an apology for picking Fried over him. Quit with the Stieber slights please. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tony Ramos was an NCAA champion at Terry's weight. Is there any question that Terry Brands would beat Ramos to a pulp? Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

 

Tom versus Stieber is a different and more interesting question. It is very hard to pick that one. I personally believe Alan Fried was as good as Stieber is now and probably better. And Brands didn't quite own Fried but was the significant favorite. I know the transitive property doesn't work in wrestling, etc. etc. I just think junior or senior Tom would beat junior Stieber but it would be very close.

 

Wrestlingnerd, you owe Stieber an apology for picking Fried over him. Quit with the Stieber slights please. :)

 

Stieber is one of my favorite current wrestlers. I would not slight him. Fried is in my opinion one of the best NCAA wrestlers ever and his one title does absolutely no justice to how good he was. I owe nobody an apology.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tony Ramos was an NCAA champion at Terry's weight. Is there any question that Terry Brands would beat Ramos to a pulp? Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

 

Tom versus Stieber is a different and more interesting question. It is very hard to pick that one. I personally believe Alan Fried was as good as Stieber is now and probably better. And Brands didn't quite own Fried but was the significant favorite. I know the transitive property doesn't work in wrestling, etc. etc. I just think junior or senior Tom would beat junior Stieber but it would be very close.

 

Unless Kelber is there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Another Fried Forum? Lets not even compare the two anymore. Here's the bottom line, Brands was 3 time NCAA Champ and olrmpic Gold Medalist. who cares that Fried thinks Brand wasn't as dominate as others.

All Brands did was win!

 

That was the point Fried made. Brands wasn't as dominant as people on the outside would believe, he won all the time but he did not dominate the way other guys who won a lot did. Fried has a good perspective on it, and I think he's right. Brands was so motivated to win he would not let things get in his way of doing just that. He had amazing mental toughness.

 

BTW take a remedial English class.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

quote]

 

I love how in the eyes of wrestling fans, these athletes are ageless lol. Brands wins with one arm behind his back? At age 46, 18 years removed from his last competitive match, he's that dominant over the premier college wrestlers in the nation? Go back and look at the scores, he was pushed hard to win both years when he was in college, and lost as a junior to Jason Kelber, who I would not say was markedly better than Ramos/Graff/Colon, if at all. But now, at 46, he can do it with his arm behind his back.

 

Truth is, a 46 year old body couldn't hold up to the rigors of a Big Ten wrestling season, not even one as mentally tough as Brands. I suspect you are a younger guy or you'd know this harsh reality lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tony Ramos was an NCAA champion at Terry's weight. Is there any question that Terry Brands would beat Ramos to a pulp? Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

 

Tom versus Stieber is a different and more interesting question. It is very hard to pick that one. I personally believe Alan Fried was as good as Stieber is now and probably better. And Brands didn't quite own Fried but was the significant favorite. I know the transitive property doesn't work in wrestling, etc. etc. I just think junior or senior Tom would beat junior Stieber but it would be very close.

 

I appreciate the talent that Alan Fried was, but to just kind of dismiss Logan's possible (probable) superiority because I am guessing he is closer to your time is kind of like people who have tell you back in my day, 6 feet of snow, 2 miles uphill I walked to school and then the world reversed and I had the same exact challenge just to get home.

 

Logan as a probable 4 time champion gets my nod as probably the better talent.

 

 

Wow, what incisive analysis. Lewboo has nothing on you. You are exactly right! I did exactly that, 6 ft. of snow, and it was while doing one-legged backflips the whole way!

 

Since we are talking about how good someone was at their peak relative to another, number of NCAA titles is a pretty stupid way to assess relative levels of peak skill. If I had stated that Fried was better than Stieber throughout his entire career, maybe your brilliant commentary might make some sense, but that's not what I said. For the same reason that Jordan Burroughs or John Smith during their senior and even junior years were very likely better than just about any other college wrestler ever, even though both fall short of making the all-time overall top 10 college lists, it is actually possible for an NCAA champ to have been better at his peak than another NCAA champ with more titles. Given that Fried lost just once earlier in his career to someone other than 3x NCAA champ and Olympic champ Tom Brands, and given that he beat him a couple of times, maybe your 4> 1 argument is not as brilliant as you think it is. While Stieber was losing to a true frosh who just got beat by a HS sophomore, at a similar age, Fried was pinning Tom Brands and upsetting soon-to-be 4x NCAA champ Pat Smith who was 2 college weights heavier.

 

I have no idea what you consider "my day", since I watch more than twice as much wrestling now as I ever did and believe college wrestling is as tough now as it ever was in any other era. Stieber will go down as the much more accomplished wrestler, but whether 2014 Stieber could beat junior or senior Fried is actually an interesting question and not the foregone conclusion you think it is. My opinion is that it would be really close.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Come on, Terry Brands wins 133 this year with one arm.

quote]

 

I love how in the eyes of wrestling fans, these athletes are ageless lol. Brands wins with one arm behind his back? At age 46, 18 years removed from his last competitive match, he's that dominant over the premier college wrestlers in the nation? Go back and look at the scores, he was pushed hard to win both years when he was in college, and lost as a junior to Jason Kelber, who I would not say was markedly better than Ramos/Graff/Colon, if at all. But now, at 46, he can do it with his arm behind his back.

 

Truth is, a 46 year old body couldn't hold up to the rigors of a Big Ten wrestling season, not even one as mentally tough as Brands. I suspect you are a younger guy or you'd know this harsh reality lol.

 

 

Did you seriously just assume I meant that Terry Brands, pushing 50, would win with one arm literally tied behind his back??

 

Have you ever heard of hyperbole? Let me spell it out for you: in answer to the original poster's question, I opined that Brands, the college-aged version, would be successful today and win a title. Wrestling has not changed so much that a 2x champ, 3x finalist, and eventual world champion from 20-some years ago could not win this year against a field I consider not particularly strong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Alan Fried is interesting in comparison to David Taylor. Taylor has 2 losses to the same opponent and 1 to Bubba. Fried, I think had 5 losses to Brands and 1 to someone else, right. How come Fried doesn't get put in the same conversation as DT as being all-time great.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alan Fried is interesting in comparison to David Taylor. Taylor has 2 losses to the same opponent and 1 to Bubba. Fried, I think had 5 losses to Brands and 1 to someone else, right. How come Fried doesn't get put in the same conversation as DT as being all-time great.

 

He doesn't belong in that list. Simply not enough hardware to make any career list and too much competition for any "peak level achieved" list (all the 3- and 4-timers have a case against him and then there's the list of guys like John Smith, Gable, JB, etc. to consider). But he was way better than his single title implies given his 3-year career, rivalry with Brands, and non-March accomplishments. In a heads-up match or best of 3 series, I'd bet even money or even give a few points on junior/senior Fried against all but three or four guys from any era around his weight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...