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Interesting 70kg Entrants for WTT Phase II

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Did anyone notice some of the noticeable entrants for the 70kg World Team Trials? Below is the listing:

 

Carr, Nathaniel

Fay, Moza Army

Green, James

Hall, Adam

LeValley, Kevin

Marable, Nick

Pami, Chase

Ruschell, Kyle

Russell, Kellan

Schlatter, Dustin

Tsirtsis, Jason

Vallimont, Dan

Welch, Jason

 

It will be interesting to see how Russell does moving up a weight, how the youngster Tsirtsis does, and I have surprised to see Schlatter entered. Everyone knows he has a ton of talent and even with the long layoff, could you pose any threat to some of the higher ranked guys?

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The list is on TrackWrestling, but I'm not sure how some of those names are qualified for the event.

 

Wrestlers who meet the following criteria will be eligible for the World Team Trials Phase II:

1. Past USA World/Olympic Team member

2. Champion from a Senior-level North American or Pan American FILA International

competition from July 1st, 2013 up to the 2014 World Team Trials

3. Top 3 finisher from the 2012 Freestyle Olympic Team Trials

4. Top 3 finisher from the 2013 Freestyle World Team Trials

5. Top 7 finisher from any weight at the 2014 Freestyle U.S. Open

6. Champion of the 2014 Freestyle Northern Plains Regional

7. Champion of the 2014 Freestyle Northeast Regional

8. 2014 NCAA Division I Champion

9. Top 2 from the 2014 Freestyle University Nationals

10. One wildcard per weight may be selected by the National Freestyle Head Coach and

with approval of the Freestyle Sport Wildcard Subcommittee. See the wildcard selection

procedure below

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I really hoped to see Taylor here. Hoped he would cut the 9 lbs.

 

The way you worded your post makes it sound a TON easier for him to do than it actually is. It's not like he is walking around at 163. As long and lean as Taylor is I don't think 154 was/is a viable option. I would agree that a healthy Taylor at 154 would be hard to beat. I just don't see him being healthy at 154. In fact I don't see him weighing in at 154, period.

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Taylor walks around at 175-180 and I know it would be a difficult cut but he will not make the team at 163 and with 6 weeks to prepare for phase II he could have done it for just this year and won a world title. He has owned Marable in practice and in matches even more so than Burroughs. I just hate to see a phenom like him sit at home. would have been amazing to see him on the world team this year!

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Taylor walks around at 175-180 and I know it would be a difficult cut but he will not make the team at 163 and with 6 weeks to prepare for phase II he could have done it for just this year and won a world title. He has owned Marable in practice and in matches even more so than Burroughs. I just hate to see a phenom like him sit at home. would have been amazing to see him on the world team this year!

 

I agree. It's a big risk that he's taking by betting the house on eventually surpassing Burroughs. If the weight cut is feasible as you suggest, getting a title or two at 70 would be huge, both for his marketing potential and future coaching credentials. It might even put USA in the title hunt (probably not). Guys don't get as good as he is by taking the safe route, though....He knows that he will beat Burroughs (and Dake)...whether he ever does is another story.

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IIRC he was lighter than JB walking around at BTS NYC (yes I realize that's a lot of abbreviations). Ease up though, as nice as it'd be to see both at the world championships, we have to remember that one just locked down a coaching job, endorsements, bought a house, and his wife is about to give birth (in other words, long-term stability), and the other just graduated college and is in the stage of promoting himself that the other was in 2-3 years ago. Taylor gave it his all and did a damn fine job (arguably better than anyone in the last few years) at the open and at WTTs. If he wants to take a few months to settle in for the long haul, promote his shoe deal, and heal his body from the quick turnaround from NCAA>USAW season, then more power to him.

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I didn't realize Schlatter was still competing.  This actually could be a very good weight for him.

 

I guess Marable's the favorite but I think my money's on James Green to have a breakthrough performance here. 

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Why do so many people think Dake and Taylor would do just a well as Burroughs against world/Olympic? Even though they are incredible wrestlers, we can't be sure how they'd perform against the world's best. I have three reasons for thnking that. 

 

First, both Dake and Taylor looked extremely good against NCAA competition. But world competition is both a different style and a step up in competition. College kids who wrestle while attending classes will never do as well as men who wrestle full time.

 

Second, sure both Dake and Taylor won Hodges, but that does not guarantee anything. The only Hodge winners to win world/Olympic golds are Gutches, Neal, Sanderson, and Burroughs. Hodge winners who didn't win world-level titles include Jaworsky, McCoy, Ironside, Larkin, Mocco, Askren, Metcalf, Herbert, and Ness. Further, since 1995 when the Hodge began, a number of world-level champs were not Hodge winners at all (even though they were of college age when the Hodge was around): Varner, Cejudo, Zadick, Slay, and Henson. So since 1995, more non-Hodge winners won world-level titles than Hodge winners.

 

Third, a lot of people think Burroughs's close matches with Dake and Taylor show they are almost as good as Burroughs. I don't think that's so. Here's why.

 

(1) During all three of Burroughs's world-championship runs, Burroughs had close matches with guys who never won world-level tittles. So wrestling a close match against Burroughs doesn't necessarily mean you're as good as he is.

 

(2) Even if Dake or Taylor eventually beat Burroughs, it wouldn't necessarily mean they could win world-level titles. Marable beat Burroughs, but he hasn't shown he can win a world title. Further, McCoy beat Neal for the Olympic spot in 2000, and Neal was coming off a season where he was given FILA's Outstanding Wrestler Award. But McCoy never won a world-level title.

 

(3) When Dake and Taylor wrestled Burroughs, they knew they would face him or knew there was a good likelihood of facing him. So that means they were able to study him, train for him, and put together a game plan. At worlds, everyone you face is very tough (better than NCAA competition), and you can never be sure who you'll be facing. So you can't prepare for everybody you wrestle as well as Dake and Taylor prepared for Burroughs. That can make a difference.

 

In the end, we will only know how well Dake and Taylor would do against world competition when we see them compete in a world/Olympic competition. Anything besides that is mere speculation.

Edited by The_Education

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some good points by Education. I have high hopes for Dake and Taylor but cautious optimism would probably be the best way to describe it. 

 

Taylor has a win over Hasanov at BTS and Dake has beaten Tsargush overseas, but its tough to deduce too much from either match as they were both under extenuating circumstances.

 

ultimately Education is 100% correct that we won't know much until we see them in more international tournaments. will be exciting to watch no matter how it shakes out. 

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looking at the entrants at both weight classes, i will say, for all the drawbacks to the current weight class system, one silver lining is all the crazy match ups you might get from guys moving up and down from other weights. 

 

61kg/134lbs

Kennedy - Scott - McD - Colon - Garrett - Stieber - Hump

 

70kg/154

Marable - Green - Welch - Ian Miller - TShirt - Dieringer - Schlatter - Russell

 

that's just SOME of the names that stand out that represent from very unique and interesting match ups i dont think we'd otherwise see. 

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looking at the entrants at both weight classes, i will say, for all the drawbacks to the current weight class system, one silver lining is all the crazy match ups you might get from guys moving up and down from other weights. 

 

61kg/134lbs

Kennedy - Scott - McD - Colon - Garrett - Stieber - Hump

 

70kg/154

Marable - Green - Welch - Ian Miller - TShirt - Dieringer - Schlatter - Russell

 

that's just SOME of the names that stand out that represent from very unique and interesting match ups i dont think we'd otherwise see. 

I talked with Matt, he is focusing on getting Gilman and Ramos ready for their World Tournaments. 57 KG is where he plans to be for the future.

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as nice as it'd be to see both at the world championships, we have to remember that one just locked down a coaching job, endorsements, bought a house, and his wife is about to give birth (in other words, long-term stability), and the other just graduated college and is in the stage of promoting himself that the other was in 2-3 years ago. Taylor gave it his all and did a damn fine job (arguably better than anyone in the last few years) at the open and at WTTs. If he wants to take a few months to settle in for the long haul, promote his shoe deal, and heal his body from the quick turnaround from NCAA>USAW season, then more power to him.

 

Please elaborate. I don't see how Taylor "doing a fine job" vs Burroughs, his shoe deal, or the 6? months between NCAA season and the World Championship have anything to do with Taylor not competing at 70kg. 

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ultimately Education is 100% correct that we won't know much until we see them in more international tournaments. will be exciting to watch no matter how it shakes out. 

 

I agree that the Taylor Olympic Champ hype train seems to be leaving the station a little early. However, that still doesn't make sense of his decision to sit out the 70kg trials. He loses nothing by dropping the weight (I imagine that the 23-4 year old will be able to put it back on pretty quickly if he has to), and stands to gain a World Team berth. Baffling. 

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Taylor looks huge for 74. i'm no doctor but if he's walking around at 180lbs with very little fat to trim, then a 25lb cut sounds unhealthy. maybe it is possible but if he doesnt want to even attempt it i say more power to him. weight cutting blows and has nothing to do with the sport itself. the real shame is there is no weight class in between 74 and 86 for DT to bump up to. 

 

anyway, it's Taylor's career, he can do whatever he wants as far as i'm concerned. 

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How exactly did this get to be about David Taylor or Jordan Burroughs? Really?

 

Carr, Nathaniel
Fay, Moza Army 
Green, James
Hall, Adam
LeValley, Kevin
Marable, Nick
Pami, Chase
Ruschell, Kyle
Russell, Kellan
Schlatter, Dustin
Tsirtsis, Jason
Vallimont, Dan
Welch, Jason

That is one of the most fun and interesting brackets I have seen in a long time, and honestly, I can't pick a winner.  Can we please talk about some of these potential matchups instead of the same thing that every other thread is about?  

Schlatter vs. Marable? Vallimont vs. Welch? Green vs. Carr?

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