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MSU158

Rank the following "Great" DI coaches:

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In alphabetical order to avoid bias:

 

Stan Abel(1)

Tom Brands(3)

Tommy Chesbro(1)

Bobby Douglas(1)

Thomas Evans(2)

Tim Flynn(0)

Dan Gable(15)

E.C. Gallagher(11)

Jim Gibbons(1)

Art Griffith(8)

W.H. Horn(1)

Paul Keen(1)

Gary Kurdelmeier(2)

David McCuskey(1)

Harold Nichols(6)

Hugo Otopali(1)

Grady Peninger(1)

Port Robertson(3)

J. Robinson(3)

Myron Roderick(7)

Cael Sanderson(4)

Paul Scott(1)

Joey Seay(1)

John Smith(5)

Charles Speidel(1)

Jim Zalesky(3)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

^^^Did anyone notice what I did above?^^^

Edited by MSU158

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I guess I will start with my top 10:

 

1.)Dan Gable:  With 15 championships and a name that still resonates throughout the nation, this pick is a no-brainer.

2.)E.C. Gallagher:  2nd most championships(11) of any coach and has an arena named after him.  Enough said.

3.)Harold Nichols:  6 championships coaching a program not named Iowa or OSU. Oh, he also coached Dan Gable.

4.)Art Griffith: 8 championships for the Dynasty that was OSU.

5.)Roderick:  7 championships for the Dynasty that was OSU.

6.)John Smith:  5 championships and took over when OSU got sanctioned.  I debated putting him 4th ahead of the two predecessors directly above him.

 

Now things really get interesting as there are several coaches still coaching who can move up the list.

7.)Sanderson:  As Will Ferrell would say, "He is SOO hot right now!"

8.)J Rob:  Bringing a school not named Iowa or OSU to the forefront deserves MAJOR recognition.

9.)Brands:  Regardless of the Zalesky comparison(haters) he fits perfectly into the Iowa mentality and they are in the mix when we ALL KNOW Iowa will NEVER again be the draw that it was under Gable.

10.)Tim Flynn:  What he has done with Edinboro is amazing to me.  If you were a Blue Chip recruit why would you even consider Edinboro?  The fact that Edinboro can even be mentioned in the same sentence as Iowa, Minnesota, PSU and OkState has me SOLD!!!

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FYI: Back in 2005, for the 75th anniversary of NCAA Wrestling Championships, three college coaches were named "the greatest": Ed Gallagher, Harold Nichols, and Dan Gable. But that was nearly a decade ago.

 

Mark

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heard superold had a meeting with the edinboro president and athletic director and afterwards they all agreed with superold that this is a "make or break year for Flynn and edinboro" so if Flynn doesn't bring home a championship they will fire him and bring in the best third assistant they can afford to take the four scholarships and bring home the title Flynn hasn't been able to get

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10.)Tim Flynn:  What he has done with Edinboro is amazing to me. 

 

 

 

Are you amazed at the fact that Flynn has never had a multiple time national champion? Flynn has never had any of his champions repeat. IIrc, Flynn has produced 3 champions in 18 years.

 

Are you amazed that under Flynn Edinboro has not been able to get the full 9.9 scholarships that the other top programs have?

 

If you were a Blue Chip recruit why would you even consider Edinboro? 

 

 

 

MSU158, sit back and reflect on this quote of yours. If I'm reading you correctly, it seems that you're saying that it's hard to imagine why a top HS talent would ever consider wrestling for Flynn. Or that it's hard to imagine a reason for any blue chipper to justify picking Edinboro over the other, more proven coaches. Would you ever think of asking the same question about Iowa, Minnesota, Okie State, or PSU? I wouldn't.

 

Do you think it's possible that Flynn is the reason that many blue chippers don't consider coming to Edinboro (if that's truly the case)? Maybe his failure to produce multiple time champs turns kids away?

 

 

The fact that Edinboro can even be mentioned in the same sentence as Iowa, Minnesota, PSU and OkState has me SOLD!!!

 

 

 

How is Edinboro in the same sentence as Iowa, Minnesota, PSU, and Okie State in a meaningful way?

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I know he doesn't have a title (has a runner up) but a shame to leave Dale Thomas, Oregon State off of this list!  616-168-13 career record.  His wins record won't be touched.

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I think that Gable and Gallagher will have the highest winning % in dual meets.

 

Port Robertson doesn't get the credit he deserves. OU's program was dropped during WWII. He revived it, and once he got wrestling scholarships he had a winning record against OSU in dual meets. He retired as head coach prior to the 1959-1960 season to prepare for coaching the 1960 Olympic freestyle team. He insisted on a 6-week training camp in Norman, previously there was a 2-week training camp. Terry McCann was the only wrestler with a winning record in international competition. The others had losing records, or no record at all. With 3 gold medals it was the best performance in 50 years. The 1960 OU team won the NCAA title. In 1962 Tommy Evans was called to active duty, Port returned as head coach with the team taking 2nd. Next year Tommy returned with Port coaching the freshman, OU won the 1963 title. So Port had a major hand in 5 team titles at OU.

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Are you amazed at the fact that Flynn has never had a multiple time national champion? Flynn has never had any of his champions repeat. IIrc, Flynn has produced 3 champions in 18 years.

 

Are you amazed that under Flynn Edinboro has not been able to get the full 9.9 scholarships that the other top programs have?

 

 

 

MSU158, sit back and reflect on this quote of yours. If I'm reading you correctly, it seems that you're saying that it's hard to imagine why a top HS talent would ever consider wrestling for Flynn. Or that it's hard to imagine a reason for any blue chipper to justify picking Edinboro over the other, more proven coaches. Would you ever think of asking the same question about Iowa, Minnesota, Okie State, or PSU? I wouldn't.

 

Do you think it's possible that Flynn is the reason that many blue chippers don't consider coming to Edinboro (if that's truly the case)? Maybe his failure to produce multiple time champs turns kids away?

 

 

 

 

How is Edinboro in the same sentence as Iowa, Minnesota, PSU, and Okie State in a meaningful way?

 

 

 

Well for one, you are picking Edinboro to beat Iowa and the rest of the country at nationals next season.      I'd say that qualifies them in the same conversation.    

 

 

 

Perhaps you disagree? 

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Roderick coached from 1957-1969. Roderick won 7 National Championships.   That puts him at 7/12 or  a 58.3% National Championship rate.  Gable coached from 1976-1997.  Gable won 15 national championships.  That puts him at 15/21 or a 71.4% National Championship rate.  E.C. Gallagher coached from 1916-1940.  E.C. Gallagher won 11 championships.  That puts him at 11/25 or a 44% National Championship rate. 

 

 

The bar Gable has set is simply ridiculous.  He also won 21 Big Ten championships.  21/21.  That is unbelievable.

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Hey, it's not my fault he decided to coach a sport that didn't have a national championship......;)

 

His winning percentage truly is incredible during the initial NCAA championship years.  He won 11 championships during his last 13 years coaching OkState.  He did tie for 1st in 1933 with Iowa State.

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The following are the years(along with placement) Iowa did not win the National Championship under Gable:

 

'77-3rd

'87-2nd

'88-2nd

'89-6th

'90-3rd

'94-2nd

Any insight on what was going on in Iowa City during the "lean" year of 1989??? Thanks

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Hey, it's not my fault he decided to coach a sport that didn't have a national championship......;)

 

His winning percentage truly is incredible during the initial NCAA championship years.  He won 11 championships during his last 13 years coaching OkState.  He did tie for 1st in 1933 with Iowa State.

 

I believe that Gallagher had the unofficial top team in many of the years that he coached before the ncaa tourney existed. Gallagher's impact on American wrestling is huge. It's a shame that many younger fans don't even know who Gallagher is. 

 

Gallagher and Gable are at least a few notches above the rest imo.

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Flynn really is a top notch coach. Recruiting to Edinboro can't be easy. Koll is also a great coach.

 

Wouldn't you say that Flynn and Koll are both at least a notch below Cael, Brands, and Smith? I thought you and I were on the same page with the belief that any argument for Flynn and Koll being equal or superior to Cael as a coach was nonsense.

 

 

Recruiting to Edinboro can't be easy

 

 

Maybe Flynn's mere presence turns away higher ranked recruits from Edinboro. That's something to consider.

Edited by superold

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It upsets me that the mods delete my legitimate threads, but let this kind of stuff go one. I get it when they delete my troll threads, but those account for less than half of the threads that I create. This is clearly baiting and beating the most dead horse ever. 

 

Please moderate the boards. 

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Ok so, this topic has been hashed over many times, however, I still feel there is a good discussion about what makes a really good team, and then coach.  We always end up looking at NCAA finish, but what about a really strong dual team?  Which is the better coach, 10 really tough guys that maybe all are qualifiers and the team places top 30 and wins most or all duals, or a team with 5 AA's and the team places top 5, but wins very few duals?  I would say the coach of the good ten that win duals.  Great is if you can do both.

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