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Marsteller and OSU

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Why are Chances odds so much in his favor? Is he immune to injury or failing out of school? The odds will go way up for any top recruit if you could magically eliminate injuries and academic meltdown. You really can't have this type of discussion without looking at all of the potential adverse circumstances that can affect a wrestler. Right now it could be his back or maybe as Tirapel has alluded he's another example of a wrestler that matured early and won't come close to matching expectations in college. Maybe he fails out of school after his first semester. The point is all of these things are in play for Chance just like any other guy and there have been plenty of recent examples.

 

I believe all of these guys were 1 or 2 in at least one ranking just in the past 6-7 years: David Craig, Cody Gardner, Scott Winston, Andrew Alton, Marshall Peppleman, Eric Grajales, Andrew Campollatano. If you expand to the top 10 pound-for-pound over the years, at least a third don't AA at all in college.  

Edited by Flying-Tiger

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Not to mention guys like Josh Kindig who had some early issues but he(along with John Smith and the coaches) have been able to get him to the point where he can contend for a national title.  As mentioned previously, who knows what the real issue is but college wrestling(let alone Division I) is a different animal.  Take a look at the high school records of college kids who can't even make the lineup of a DI team and you will understand.  Another phenom from Pa, Cary Kolat, won two national titles but many thought he would win more.  He had a few issues but still had a very successful career.  There will be a period of adjustment but if he wants to figure it out, Smith and his staff will help him.

Edited by pennsyrules

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he isn't even 2nd string and people are comparing him to someone who placed 4th in the olympic trials as a high school wrestler. the argument is warped. 

 

I get what your saying and looking back at what Kolat did there is no comparison but on the surface they were both undefeated 4x PA champs and its very early on in Chances first college season. 

 

IMO we need to give Chance some more time.

 

But I am someone who thinks that Chance would have been better off at PSU. John Smith is amazing but it looked like a perfect fit at PSU with DT leaving 165 open for him.  He's cutting more weight than he has in many years just to get to 2nd string at 157 and you already have NCAA champion Dierenger at 165 for OSU and 174 IMO is too big for him with his short frame no matter how strong he is.  165 seems like a perfect fit. He would have got to wrestle with DT and Ruth often i'm sure and Cael and Varner would help.  

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Another phenom from Pa, Cary Kolat, won two national titles but many thought he would win more.  He had a few issues but still had a very successful career.  There will be a period of adjustment but if he wants to figure it out, Smith and his staff will help him.

 

Let's not put Kolat and Marsteller in the same sentence. Kolat was a title threat the moment he set foot at PSU. He was that good, certainly as good as advertised. The fact that he didn't win four titles does not mean he was a letdown in any way. Nobody can realistically be expected to win four. Kolat had an outstanding college career right from the outset. Marsteller may be third on the depth chart at OSU, and the starter is a bumped up non-AA. Worlds of difference.

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he isn't even 2nd string and people are comparing him to someone who placed 4th in the olympic trials as a high school wrestler. the argument is warped. 

who's in front of him besides Collica Blees is now at 165, he's 2-1 against Koo and won their last match and he demolished Torres  in their match he's a true freshman who's won 2 opens and only has 2 official losses on his record this year this is probably the first time he's had to cut weight like this and for the most part he's looked alright give him time to develop and get accustomed 

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who's in front of him besides Collica Blees is now at 165, he's 2-1 against Koo and won their last match and he demolished Torres  in their match he's a true freshman who's won 2 opens and only has 2 official losses on his record this year this is probably the first time he's had to cut weight like this and for the most part he's looked alright give him time to develop and get accustomed 

 

Agreed, but let's not compare him to Kolat. Way off base. I really hope he does well, would like to see him win a title before all is said and done. I loved his style in HS and hope he can continue it in college.

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Cut the guy some slack.  He has 0 official losses.  I don't think its way off base to compare him to anyone, its just that apples and apples have to be compared.  He is redshirting, so compare him to redshirts.  Even Sanderson lost as a red shirt.

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My point is simply this:

 

  • The kid has wrestled for one month in college.
  • He still has 5 more years to perform
  • He was as dominant as anyone in high school... ever!
  • There are other top kids who have struggled.
  • He is in a great program.

Give him time and he will be fine provided he wants to achieve.  This is Divison I and there will be struggles.  Leave the kid alone.

Edited by pennsyrules

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Cut the guy some slack.  He has 0 official losses.  I don't think its way off base to compare him to anyone, its just that apples and apples have to be compared.  He is redshirting, so compare him to redshirts.  Even Sanderson lost as a red shirt.

 

Not to drag this on, but Kolat competed for PSU as a true freshman. He lost a close one to Jaworksy and got 2nd. As a true freshman.

 

Comparing Marsteller to Kolat IS apples to apples. The problem is the comparison is terrible, since at the moment, the two are not remotely alike in any way other than the fact that they're both from Pennsylvania. Kolat delivered on the enormous hype right out of the gates, as a true freshman. So far, Marsteller has done the opposite.

 

I'm not trying to put Marsteller down. Like I said, I am rooting for him to do well. I am just pointing out how bad the comparison to Kolat is. Kolat was not just on a different level but on a different planet at the same point in his career. Maybe Marsteller will eventually go on to be a 2x NCAA champ and 4x AA who only loses twice in four years at NCAAs, and maybe he'll end his college career pinning half the kids he beats with only seven losses. But until he shows a whole lot more than he has so far, the comparison to one of the best college wrestlers ever deserves to be shot down immediately. Marsteller can't even beat the kids in his weight class at his own school. At the same time in his career, Kolat could beat half his team's line-up and everyone at his weight in the country other than TJ Jaworksy to boot.

Edited by wrestlingnerd

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CM may be the most physically mature 8th grader I've ever seen.  He was a 13 year old in a 19 year old body.  He's a fantastic wrestler, and will have a solid college career if he stays healthy and out of trouble.

That said, the physical gap that he had for his entire HS career is gone.  

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Agreed with Headshuck.  This general topic has gotten completely off the rails.  The point is... a kid with this amount of hype should be winning wrestleoffs on his own team, CONVINCINGLY, especially if those opponents are not AA's preceding him.  He is not.  

 

So many kids have hype (but less of it), and perform better than what Chance has shown thus far.  Will he get better?  Maybe, but this is about coming in with expectations that are extremely lofty, failing to win his own weight class at his own school, and then having his 'supporters' derive inane excuses as to what's going on.  

 

On Chance's side, the only other HS kids left that will have this amount of hype are Hall and Lee by the time they get to college age.  They too shall feel the wrath of D1 College wrestling (presuming they go), and if they fail, the 'hype' was for naught.  HS performance is an extremely good indicator of potential college performance, BUT... not 100% of the time.  

 

Good luck Chance... we all wish you well, and that you turn it around.  However, the current results shown thus far put you squarely 'in the middle' of the pack.

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My point is simply this:

 

  • The kid has wrestled for one month in college.
  • He still has 5 more years to perform
  • He was as dominant as anyone in high school... ever!
  • There are other top kids who have struggled.
  • He is in a great program.

Give him time and he will be fine provided he wants to achieve.  This is Divison I and there will be struggles.  Leave the kid alone.

 

 

Mocco was more dominant

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I wouldn't call PA AAA wrestling a small pond. He beat plenty of great wrestlers in PA, and did well for himself at Powerade. 

 

He also won Super32 and was in the Cadet World semi finals before dislocating his elbow. Wrestled in multiple cadet and junior duals teams and had won Fargo. Injuries didn't help the cause for some other post season action, but it's not like he never left the state.

 

However, I agree, with his reputation, I would expect him to be winning in his own room. Personally, I think the weight cut might be harder than expected. He picked his situation, though, and has to decide to overcome it on his own.

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