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GoldenGofer

If Gwiz wins next year where does he rank all-time among heavies?

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Gwiaz has a good chance to win 3 (and maybe close career with a 90 match winning streak) in a great era of athletic heavyweights. Talking college career only, I truly would be tempted to put him at #1 IF he runs the table next year.

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Earl McCready, Dick Hutton, Jimmy Jackson, and Carleton Haselrig are the only 3-time champs at heavyweight that I can come up with. If there are more Lewboo will let me know. I think Neal should have been a 3-timer, bogus stalling call sent it into OT when there was only a 30-second rideout, McCoy won the toss and chose down. Stephen hit a standing granby in that match.

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Gwiz is the second coming of Tervel.  A real breath of fresh air in the heavy-weight class.  Not afraid to get under the big guys, and more importantly can take them down when he does.  I simply couldn't believe how he was able to take down Nelson and Coon, two big, big defensive wrestlers, who routinely crush anyone who goes to their legs.

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Neal still a touch more offensive and athletic IMO but you could make the case Gwiz had a better career with an extra title...if he gets it.

 

I'm with you. Neal had stiffer competition, though. Neal was bigger, stronger, and just better. But Gwiz is definitely not far behind in athleticism. Among current D1 heavies, he is unique. He looks like he has a ways to go in terms of development too, if he chooses to pursue freestyle. No offense intended to his coaches at all, but I can't imagine his training situation is ideal at NC State given the lack of elite workout partners.

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Hutton was a three time champ and missed winning the fourth on a controversial referee's decision.  I think he would be the most highly ranked Heavyweight.

 

Hutton would have been the first four time champ at any weight.

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I think we need to wait a decade before we can say that Neal had "better competition." Yes, McCoy was a stud and placed in the worlds once but nobody else from that era did much in freestyle and nobody medaled in an Olympics. Let's see how this shakes out. Gwiaz prevented Nelson from being a 3 timer at the college level and it is certainly possible that some of the guys wrestling today (most likely Gwiaz and Coon) can get some hardware at the next level.

 

Overall you can't just say 3 timer >2 timer, level of competition should come in to play. But we need to wait to decide on that. In the post-Hasselrig era McCoy and Neal are the two that would be in the conversation. I guess you could argue Konrad...but I won't.

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Actually he admitted he was pinned by Bill Kalkbrenner OU sophomore hwt, in the year after the 1972 Olympics. The dual was at Ames, Phil Parker former Iowa State wrestler was hired by Harold Nichols as the official. Taylor would let guys underhook him so he could do his double overhook lateral drop. Bill is about 6-4 with long arms and extremely strong, his favorite move was a bearhug. They locked up Taylor went to his back and started rolling from one shoulder to the other. Parker wouldn't call the fall. The 1st period ends, Bill gets up celebrating because he thought he gotten the pin. Next period Taylor pinned him.

 

I was standing next to Bill at the Big 8 when Chris walked up and said Mr. Kalkbrenner, I was stuck! The previous year Bill Struve the OU hwt. Ducked Taylor, but his arms weren't long enough to lock his hands. He got a quick standup for an escape and settled for the 1-1 draw.

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Lets not forget 6 time NCAA champion Carlton Haselrig

 

If I had to rank them, Neal has to be at the very top.   Haselrig is way up there as well and then guys like Mocco and Konrad.    The NC State kid looks great, maybe top 5 is about where I'd put him. 

I'm not disagreeing with you Cletus, but once Kerry McCoy moved up from 190 pounds as a freshman he went 137-1 as a heavy. Including a 2-0 record in college against Steve Neal. 

 

McCoy was strong, fast and athletic enough to wrestle with anyone at 275 (or 285 - and likely the old unlimited class)

 

If Neal's at the top, McCoy is certainly right there.

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